What's with all the hub-bub?

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What's with all the hub-bub?

Post  Silvinia on Thu Dec 11, 2008 2:42 pm

This is more of a challenge that I'm issuing to the shell as a whole rather than individuals, though I may point out some specifics in here as well.

First of all. Kirin... Yes it was a win... not the greatest win, but a win nonetheless. We merely 20 manned him, I'd like to argue barely at that. So my question to you is... if we were able to squeak through a Kirin... how do you keep wiping to Byakko? I mean the strategies (that this shell uses) are different, yes. I'll be honest we may be the last "kiting" shell on Caitsith.

I was not there for the Byakko wipe, nor can I fathom how it happened other than people panicked when the tanks died. That's one thing that has always been a downfall to the majority of this shell that participated under my leadership. When things fall apart people panic and don't know how to save the moment, or buy time to continue on to the next.

People need to get back to square one and realize what their jobs truly entail in sky. Do not groan if you are told to come something else or change jobs... you want gear? Work as a group.

#1 Item I've noticed needs fixing in sky. Healing magic > all other. If a tank is about dead and you notice he needs healing that is not coming from anywhere else, I don't care what job or mage type or what you think is not your responsibility. ALL MAGES NUMBER ONE PRIORITY = HEALING. I don't care if you are BLM/RDM... you have cure 3, and if you are not mid cast of something and have the mp for it and the tank(s) is at 110/1349, you better be casting that spell on that tank, because guess what, when that tank goes down... shit will go down hill fast. I'm being flat honest here. This has come from EVERY tank, including myself, Ronit, Doncado, and the history of SK tanks (Dryden, Claudus, Tanker, Bloodlust, Takehiko, shall I go on...) OUR MAGE STAFF SUCKS IT UP, HARDCORE. Don't try to play a pity game, don't say well it's not me, even if you are curing and another mage is fucking off... it's your problem too. Nobody has sugar coated it in tells to me over time. EVERY tank I've ever seen in sky for our LS... has complained about the lack of cures they receive over all.

My testimonial... I have counted numerous times where my HP as NIN was red and stayed red for periods of 30sec+ and died not shortly after struggling to keep shadows up to live... 7 utsu shadows... red HP for that long of time... what where our mages doing? Stoneskin, Paralyze, Slow...

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Re: What's with all the hub-bub?

Post  Aricant on Thu Dec 11, 2008 3:52 pm

Well...... shit.
Stoneskin, Paralyze, Slow --- those are my favorite spells! Sad
Point noted. Thanks for your comments.

I'll strive to get more cure-action going.

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Re: What's with all the hub-bub?

Post  Aricant on Thu Dec 11, 2008 4:38 pm

How do we keep wiping to Byakko?

Basically, it goes something like this...
Byakko gets popped before everybody is ready.
Fight starts out ok, but everybody is doing their own thing.
Tanks go down.
Byakko runs amok, we run around like keystone cops.
We wipe.
We try to recover, SAC him to keep claim.
Eventually, we lose the battle as we can't raise people and get them healed before he wipes us again.
(In one of those fights, I went through a complete RR earring.)
We lose claim, he despawns.

It sucks.
We suck.


Some thoughts:
1. Maybe we don't have the right jobs/parties there. Maybe we're short on tanks, or healers, or whatever.
2. Maybe we have flawed tactics.
3. Maybe we're poorly organized. Who should be doing what. Who should be working with whom.
4. Certainly, we lack leadership. A lot of the people who do know what the hell they're doing, and know how to organize and lead the group have moved on or don't come to sky anymore. Even though I've spent quite a bit of time in sky now, and I'm learning, I don't feel competent leading the group. I'm just doing what I can to help out.

So far, my plan for Byakko is to:
1. Wait until we've got 2 or 3 popsets.
2. Schedule this well in advance, and make sure we've got the people we need to take him down.
3. Require that *everybody* has RR. We just can't seem to recover if we're relying on one or two mages to get everybody up. ( For example, we'd be better off, I think, if the mages kept peeps alive, instead of raising dead ones.)
4. Go over the plan in advance on job responsibilities, how we'll handle his 2-hr. How we'll recover if things go awry. etc.

We've got good peeps in this linkshell who have worked hard and been patient for Byakko drops. I'd like to see them get 'em.

I want to help peole have fun, and get the rewards they seek.
I don't want to waste people's time.
I'd appreciate any help/suggestions.

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Re: What's with all the hub-bub?

Post  fluster on Fri Dec 12, 2008 5:05 am

One thing I noticed on our last Byakko run.

Byakko is a pain in the ass to get to. We got lucky on our last run through as the right door was open (blue?) I then sat in the monolith room while the last couple of people came through. I think we waited on 2-3 people. One was Ari, who was leading the way through, and another was a job change I believe. The majority of the group had made it Byakko and had gotten tp before porting down.

As the last of the group made it to Byakko's island and ported down we popped Byakko almost immediately. I realize there is a lot of waiting on this fight and everyone is antsy to get cooking, but we see the results of rushing. After spending the amount of time to get the pops, travel to Byakko, and actually start the fight, what is waiting another 5 minutes so everyone can properly buff and regain mp?

We need to be properly set up before we pop any God. For the time being I believe we should discuss how we are going to handle the 2-hour ability of any mob. Shit BB almost wiped us last week. We need to get back to basics.

Since I am a career ranger some job specific observations:

(1) We need a shadowbind order. I am just as guilty as every other ranger. I have taken for granted that Shadowbind will not be broken. Each ranger should have his macro set on instructing who the next ranger in the order is. AF Gloves need to be equipped, pull the set out of storage if that is where you have it. The additional time these gloves add to Shadowbind are crucial. I will be sure to take care of this next run with whatever rangers show up. So please give us a few minutes as people will need to reset some macros I am sure.

(2) If you have ranger leveled to 75 you must have a complete set of winds. They drop often enough each one of us should have them. With unlimited shot they are never lost. Any new ranger to sky should be lotting these as they drop. Rangers also need to cap Throwing. It is fairly easy to do. For the super anal you can pick up a hurling belt with assault points. These winds do more damage then a normal ranged attack and weaken whatever god is being attacked. if you have a question what wind to use ask me in game. I have 4 macros set up with the name of the god we are fighting. It automatically hits unlimited shot and the proper wind. BE SURE TO MACRO BACK IN BOLTS/ARROWS/BULLETS SO THE NEXT SHOT OFF DOES NOT FIRE OF THE WIND. In any given fight I will wait for the tanks to get hate, dump my tp through slugshot/sidewinder then fire off a wind. During a typical fight unlimited shot can be used 2-3 times and the damage is noticeable. I also have a macro stating in ls chat if/when the wind lands.

(3) I have very nice strength gearset up and 8/8 merits on markmanship but on Gods like Byakko I still find myself needing racc. All rangers should be popping off racc food (i prefer sole sushi then squid sushi) Most racc gear can be purchased cheaply. If you have newly leveled ranger an Ohat is priceless piece of equipment. If you need an Ohat post an event request or let a ls leader know. I am sure anytime we have 3-4- people looking for an ohat we can schedule a run. I have 90 Alchemy on a mule and can craft clusters if needed.

(4) Ammo. Use the good stuff. Darksteel Bolts, Kaburra Arrows, Silver Bullets, maybe Demon Arrows but I rarely see the additional effects proc on Byakko. If cost is a concern to you I can craft all three types. I can craft the ds boltheads as well. Anyone that is really hurting for cash for ammo I can set up a day to go ram farming. With 2 people to hold ram drops I can easily craft a couple of stacks of arrows and leather. So for an afternoon of farming I can hook you up with ammo and an ah sellable item if you bring materials.

Just my thoughts.

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Re: What's with all the hub-bub?

Post  Silvinia on Fri Dec 12, 2008 6:48 am

Again, I dont' know what all has changed in the past 6 months. But this is the way he should be tanked.

2x PLD/NIN
1x WHM
1x RDM/WHM
2x BRD/WHM
If no second BRD, a SMN/WHM

Beyond that all DD.

The tanks should have the following buffs up before a pop is even considered.

Haste
Utsusemi
Protect 5
Shell 5
Phalanx 2
Food
2x Mambo
2x March
If no dual BRD, then 1x Mambo 1x March, and the SMN should use AoE Stoneskin and AoE ACC/EVA

Byakko is not one we can really "take hits from", anyone that has been hit by him should know that by now. He has a NASTY habit of triple attacking. So take that 300-400 dmg you take, reduce it to 200-300, multiply it by 3, and that's what you are expecting your tanks to handle if you don't properly buff them. I'm sorry no tank can handle more than 2 attack rounds of triple attacks from him... unless they have Aegis, and last I checked, we have no relic holders.

Stun order... my god, every time I try to get people to follow one, it's like screaming at a brick wall.
How hard is it really to add the following line to your stun macro...
/p (Stun) (Just used it.) <call> ---> [insert name] YOU'RE NEXT!

For fuck sake... I'm NIN/DRK and I have that in my stun macro...

There should be no excuse as to why we can't follow a stun order. "Oh I was mid cast." Well if you pay attention to how far off in line you are, you'll be ready when it's your turn... instead of actually waiting for your name to come up in the macro. Then again that's requiring people to think lol.

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Re: What's with all the hub-bub?

Post  Silvinia on Fri Dec 12, 2008 7:11 am

PS. I think the three of us are the only ones that come to the site LOL!

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I dont know about us sucking

Post  jrwild on Fri Dec 12, 2008 8:38 am

All i can say is having a single mage dedicated to remove paralise per tank is crutical. it is imposible for me to get shadows up when Roar is in effect on me. I do recall getting cure bombed from from the mages, which is not a bad thing but having paralise removed is actually more important. And the mage need to adjust themselves to not get paralis also.

Also having the same kind of tanks helps 2 nin or 2 pld works better. It keeps hate bounching and that all important ichi cast is a lot easier to get off.

As far as the reraise thing goes i can only agree. if we are fighting a poped nm every1 should have rr on and eat food. points should be not awarded to people saving gil. Every1 is up there gettin end gear items and the 5k you spend on food and 2 rr charges should not even come into mind. And i am sure if you forget some1 will be more then happy to give you a item.

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Re: What's with all the hub-bub?

Post  Silvinia on Fri Dec 12, 2008 9:39 am

All i can say is having a single mage dedicated to remove paralise per tank is crutical. it is imposible for me to get shadows up when Roar is in effect on me. I do recall getting cure bombed from from the mages, which is not a bad thing but having paralise removed is actually more important. And the mage need to adjust themselves to not get paralis also.

Also having the same kind of tanks helps 2 nin or 2 pld works better. It keeps hate bounching and that all important ichi cast is a lot easier to get off.

Absolutely right on the money there Jr. You could not be any more on the nose with that.

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